Do you think USM could make it as a independent?
- Thread starter EagleDon
- Start date
I don't think we would survive. Notre Dame, Army and BYU are currently the only independents. They all bring something unique and I don't think we do. We would probably have 7 road games every year. If we played 6 body bag games we could probably survive as an independent.
6, 7, 8 and 9 win seasons with NO bowl bids, ZERO conference dollars for anything, impossible scheduling for the minor and for home football games....we DO need a better conference, yes, but we do NOT need to go independent.
No, we'd plummet further into the depths of hell. Even in this crappy conference we have an outside shot at a BCS bowl.
Yes. I think we would flurish as an indy if we did it right. And it wouldn't have to be permanent. Eventually work our way to a better conference. Cusa has zero value to us now. I think we get around 200k per year from new tv contract. Correct me if im wrong.
These teams bring zero fans to our games so that generates no revenue. Im sure we could schedule memphis, ull and other regional teams that would bring more fans. In addition to getting the occasional p5 school. Even if did a 2 for 1. We seem to be able to get paid big time for the p5 away games. Dont see why we cant work on 2-3 of those a year and make more money than cusa has ever provided us. And do you honestly care about missing out on the Italian meatball bowl somewhere in idaho on Christmas eve against eastern michigan?
These teams bring zero fans to our games so that generates no revenue. Im sure we could schedule memphis, ull and other regional teams that would bring more fans. In addition to getting the occasional p5 school. Even if did a 2 for 1. We seem to be able to get paid big time for the p5 away games. Dont see why we cant work on 2-3 of those a year and make more money than cusa has ever provided us. And do you honestly care about missing out on the Italian meatball bowl somewhere in idaho on Christmas eve against eastern michigan?
I was about to say the same thing about the bowls. The quality of the opponent isn't great. I don't think I would miss the bowl, especially if it is the NO bowl.
Fortunately our AD has addressed this sanely and NO ONE who really understands the landscape has ever given support to going indy, not the coaches and nor anyone on the leadership team. There are broad disagreements on a number of issues relating to coaches, facilities, scheduling philosophies and our place in the NCAA....but they are all in agreement we need a conference.
Finally, the kids who play the games care about the championships, the bowls, and the rings. The teams from a bygone era who were on great teams but had no chance to play for bowl bids and championships cared. The coaches care, the players care, as awful as CUSA is these days, the powers that be know going independent is suicide. That idea is DOA. The thing to do is not move OUT until we can move UP.
Finally, the kids who play the games care about the championships, the bowls, and the rings. The teams from a bygone era who were on great teams but had no chance to play for bowl bids and championships cared. The coaches care, the players care, as awful as CUSA is these days, the powers that be know going independent is suicide. That idea is DOA. The thing to do is not move OUT until we can move UP.
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Should our leaders fail to get us in the AAC at next opportunity we might as well, and at least die with our boots on.
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In 2016 can an independent team's schedule look like this? Is a bowl game absolutely out of the question? Notice the tv schedule and money games. UMass can!
Sep. 3
at Florida Gators Ben Hill Griffin Stadium, Gainesville, FL 7:30pm ET
SECN
Sep. 10
Boston College Eagles Gillette Stadium, Foxborough, MA Noon ET
ASN/SNY/ESPN3
Sep. 17
FIU Golden Panthers McGuirk Stadium, Amherst, MA 3:30pm ET
ASN/ESPN3
Sep. 24
Mississippi State Bulldogs Gillette Stadium, Foxborough, MA 3:30pm ET
ASN/ESPN3
Oct. 1
Tulane Green Wave (HC)McGuirk Stadium, Amherst, MA 3:30pm ET
ASN/ESPN3
Oct. 7
at Old Dominion MonarchsForeman Field, Norfolk, VA 8:00pm ET
CUSA.TV
Oct. 15
Louisiana Tech Bulldogs Gillette Stadium, Foxborough, MA 3:30pm ET
ASN/ESPN3 Buy
Oct. 22
at South Carolina Gamecocks Williams-Brice Stadium, Columbia, SC Time TBA
TV TBA
Oct. 29
McGuirk Stadium, Amherst, MA Noon ET
ASN/ESPN3
Tickets
Saturday
Nov. 5
at Troy Trojans Veterans Memorial Stadium, Troy, AL Time TBA
TV TBA
Nov. 12 OFF
Nov. 19
at BYU Cougars LaVell Edwards Stadium, Provo, UT Time TBA
Oceanic PPV Buy
Nov. 26
at Hawaii Rainbow Warriors Aloha Stadium, Honolulu, HI
Point taken, but I am afraid it's a dead end road ultimately. Plus we have the minor sports....tough times ahead for independents, even Notre Dame.
You're probably right, but I'd like to see the results of a real financial study. People tend to blow it off as absurd without ever really putting forth some data. I wouldn't expect to turn into a ND, but to use it as a way to increase exposure and $ until a brighter opportunity comes along should be considered.
I tend to prefer the idea of independence in "almost" all aspects of life. My hope is one day football will cycle back to what it was a generation ago. I doubt it ever will.
I tend to prefer the idea of independence in "almost" all aspects of life. My hope is one day football will cycle back to what it was a generation ago. I doubt it ever will.
I didn't realize UMass left the MAC. They play in Gillette Stadium which holds roughly 68k and our stadium holds 34k. They can schedule home and home games with their stadium size. We can't really be compared to them.
What does stadium size have to do with home and home scheduling? I agree we can't be compared to them.
"Minutemen have eight victories and 40 losses, have averaged less than the NCAA minimum attendance of 15,000 for their homes games and were essentially kicked out of a conference."
https://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/...independent/gj6qA6Q4ubSA89xQnq6IRO/story.html
It has everything to do with it. That is the exact argument Ole Miss has made for years. Tulane got a home and home with Texas because of the Superdome.
not sure what exactly youre referring to when you say the AD addressed this sanely. I did hear his response in an online chat. it was indeed sane, but he seemed to blow it off and just say, "no bowls, no conference championship and no chance at "BCS" bowl (or whatever the BCS bowls are called now)", from my recollection. he didn't mention a scheduling problem or discuss the multiple "money games" we could add.
I meant rationally. It has been bought up from time to time over the years but no one I can recall did more than simply dismiss it....why...? It took us years to get here. Of course CUSA has gone backwards, shockingly so we all agree, since we lost Louisville, Houston, ECU, etc. but if CUSA is so horrible we should win it going away and we haven't since Fedora left. I say lets WIN the thing and find our way UP.
as far as scheduling, I don't see how it wont work in our favor. certainly we can schedule home and homes with a number of teams in our region and some historical opponents that would generate much more interest and revenue, compared to these cusa teams. for example;
Memphis, Houston, ECU, Tulane, SMU, UCF, Troy, ULL, Ark St, South Alabama, ULM, Marshall, La Tech, Marshall and Louisville.
Throw in some money games with virtually any of the big time programs in the SEC, ACC and Big 12 (even Big Ten or Pac 12, think Nebraska, Cal games). Those can be all away games with perhaps 2 for 1s, while getting paid millions. perhaps 2-3 of those a year.
Then, you have the middle of pack schools in the P5. could possibly get some home and homes. dozens of those schools.
then can have an FCS or local SWAC game if needed. I bet an indy like BYU could work a deal too. heck, try for UM / MSU series again (even if in Jackson).
ive never scheduled a game obviously, but we only need 12 and we would generate a lot more money and have much more exposure on TV. that would help with the perception of our program to recruits.
Or do you think games with Charlotte, FIU, FAU, Old Dominion, North Texas, West Kentucky and UTSA on beIN network and online streams will draw more revenue, interest and better recruits, while also believing that being in CUSA will generate more revenue than playing two-three, $1 and 2 million dollar games a year?
Memphis, Houston, ECU, Tulane, SMU, UCF, Troy, ULL, Ark St, South Alabama, ULM, Marshall, La Tech, Marshall and Louisville.
Throw in some money games with virtually any of the big time programs in the SEC, ACC and Big 12 (even Big Ten or Pac 12, think Nebraska, Cal games). Those can be all away games with perhaps 2 for 1s, while getting paid millions. perhaps 2-3 of those a year.
Then, you have the middle of pack schools in the P5. could possibly get some home and homes. dozens of those schools.
then can have an FCS or local SWAC game if needed. I bet an indy like BYU could work a deal too. heck, try for UM / MSU series again (even if in Jackson).
ive never scheduled a game obviously, but we only need 12 and we would generate a lot more money and have much more exposure on TV. that would help with the perception of our program to recruits.
Or do you think games with Charlotte, FIU, FAU, Old Dominion, North Texas, West Kentucky and UTSA on beIN network and online streams will draw more revenue, interest and better recruits, while also believing that being in CUSA will generate more revenue than playing two-three, $1 and 2 million dollar games a year?
to answer the original question; we will be getting paid about $200,000 a year from the new cusa tv contract. in other words, we aren't really getting paid at all. auburn and bama are paying us something like $1.5 - 2 million to play them. think about that a second. we get NOTHING by playing these crapusa teams year in / year out. two-three exposure/revenue games get us $3-6 million a year. think about that again.
You mean what does each team get paid by their conference through the tv contract? Idk. I think they are still under their existing / old contract. If so, its well over a million per team. Prob over 2-3 million.
Found a link. Currently, aac gets 2 million per school. Mwc gets 1.7 million. Mac gets 670,000. Cusa gets 200,000. Sunbelt gets 100,000.
The p5 get between 527-300 million per conference. You can do the math on that per team.
The p5 get between 527-300 million per conference. You can do the math on that per team.
It is amazing USM can be competitive with any of those p5 conferences. The AAC deal runs through 2020. I didn't realize that conference was getting that much more money. If I had to choose between the Sunbelt or C-USA I would rather be in the Sunbelt. At least most of the conference games would be within easy driving distance and that would for sure make up the extra 100k per year. They are getting rid of NMST and Idaho. I would miss Marshall and Tech but that is about it.
The premise of your statement implies that you think USM is currently competitive with P5 conferences. I what measurable way?
Sorry to re-print the long quote, but Aub Bry's UMass example is one heck of an example.In 2016 can an independent team's schedule look like this? Is a bowl game absolutely out of the question? Notice the tv schedule and money games. UMass can!
Sep. 3
Ben Hill Griffin Stadium, Gainesville, FL 7:30pm ET
SECN
Sep. 10
Gillette Stadium, Foxborough, MA Noon ET
ASN/SNY/ESPN3
Sep. 17
McGuirk Stadium, Amherst, MA 3:30pm ET
ASN/ESPN3
Sep. 24
Gillette Stadium, Foxborough, MA 3:30pm ET
ASN/ESPN3
Oct. 1
McGuirk Stadium, Amherst, MA 3:30pm ET
ASN/ESPN3
Oct. 7
Foreman Field, Norfolk, VA 8:00pm ET
CUSA.TV
Oct. 15
Gillette Stadium, Foxborough, MA 3:30pm ET
ASN/ESPN3 Buy
Oct. 22
Williams-Brice Stadium, Columbia, SC Time TBA
TV TBA
Oct. 29Wagner Seahawks
McGuirk Stadium, Amherst, MA Noon ET
ASN/ESPN3
Tickets
Saturday
Nov. 5
Veterans Memorial Stadium, Troy, AL Time TBA
TV TBA
Nov. 12 OFF
Nov. 19
LaVell Edwards Stadium, Provo, UT Time TBA
Oceanic PPV Buy
Nov. 26
Aloha Stadium, Honolulu, HI
Because I know we could beat a lot of these teams. Most of these conferences are extremely top heavy.
We're having trouble with scheduling 4 OOC games now. Imagine doing 12 each year. No one wants to play us. Scheduling is a nightmare. Those of you dream up these schedules are living in a dream world. We can't get any of the AAC teams to play us. Almost none of the P5 teams will play us. Going independent would be the end of the athletic program.
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As I recall Gillette Stadium is thirty or more miles from the UMass campus. It is very difficult to build support in a situation like this. Also the MAC asked UMass to leave due to among other things low home attendance. Will UMass follow Idaho?
How would we support the other sports besides football, (men's) basketball and baseball? They can't be sustained as independent programs. Not even the independent football teams try that. And CUSA is not going to let us stay if we go independent in football. The conference rules says you can't do that and that's probably the main reason why UAB backed out of killing off its football program. The other schools in the conference have made it clear they won't bend on that rule and there are no viable alternatives. Our choices for the non-football sports would be what? The Sunbelt? The Southland? As bad as CUSA is in football, it's heads and shoulders above those conferences in other sports.
I could see making an argument for getting out of the conference is we were just dominating it for 3-4 years, loosing to no team in it, but not getting much of any mention in the media or looks at for one of the Access Bowls if we lost 1 game or even udnefeated due to a perceived weak conference.
But in the last 5 years we have a loosing conference record. Havn't won a title. Havn't sniffed rankings. And basically are an afterthought.
This isn't the late 90's-early 2000's any more. Sadly, I do not think USM will reach those heights again. Our chances to move up were when Cincy, Louisville and TCU did it 12 years or so ago. We were too busy falling on our own face and trying to keep CUSA going to see what was about to happen. We let our chance pass us by. This is the new reality.
But in the last 5 years we have a loosing conference record. Havn't won a title. Havn't sniffed rankings. And basically are an afterthought.
This isn't the late 90's-early 2000's any more. Sadly, I do not think USM will reach those heights again. Our chances to move up were when Cincy, Louisville and TCU did it 12 years or so ago. We were too busy falling on our own face and trying to keep CUSA going to see what was about to happen. We let our chance pass us by. This is the new reality.
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